Should I Write A Book?

John: 00:00:01

Angie,

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Angie: John,

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John: do you have a book?

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Angie: are you asking if I can read?

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John: No, have you written a book?

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Angie: Oh, I'm thinking about it.

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Why have you?

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John: I'm writing one at the moment.

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I'm starting to think it's really

important for coaches to have one.

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Angie: All right.

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I'm hooked.

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Let's talk about books today.

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John: Angie, it seems like everywhere

I look at the moment, People are

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talking about how important it is to

have your own book for your business

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if you are a coach a speaker or any

anything in the Personal development

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I say information sector and personal

development industry that it's really

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important to have that and And it has got

me thinking and it has got me revisiting

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a book that i've been looking at But

have you been feeling the same thing?

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Angie: So I'm going to make you laugh.

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I've been writing my

book probably since: 2016

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and it didn't, yeah, it's been a long

time and why am I still writing it?

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I just haven't gone back to it because

it didn't, I didn't start out with it.

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The idea wasn't to write a book.

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I started journaling and.

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As I was journaling at the time on this

topic of, what was going on in my life

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at the time, I started to realize that

wait a minute, I'm a coach, right?

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This could actually be useful, a tool.

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A guide for people.

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So I shifted it, but yes, so here I am,

though, all these years later, and I have

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still, I have not completed the book, not

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John: What sort of

stages are at the moment

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Angie: So I probably have like

a serious great three chapters.

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And it's not going to be a long book.

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This isn't going to be

a 500 page novel, right?

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This is not that.

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But what I did do recently, because

I do not just because I don't want

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to finish it just to finish it.

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But what I did do is I've actually

outlined the last the last six or

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seven chapters, like what I want

to talk about in those, so I'm I'm

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going from it being this natural let

me just get the thoughts on paper.

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To organizing it like in a

way that if I was a reader,

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it would actually make sense.

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So I'm treating it like a book, right?

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And not just the journal.

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John: Okay.

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But have you reinvigorated

your drive, your passion to

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move ahead with the book now?

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Angie: Yeah, because now it's in

my, it's like part of my practice.

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Like it's part of my vision for my

business because although it didn't,

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it wasn't born from, Oh, let me write a

book, that'll be great for my business.

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I can now turn it into that.

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I can take this other great idea,

this content and turn it into.

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So I do have more passion because

I actually think there's a lot of

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information that based on what I do every

day is a great supplement to what I do.

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I guess I could say it that way.

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It's a great supplement to what

I do every day, a great add on.

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And who

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John: So many questions.

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So many people say that the best business

card you can have is your own book.

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And I agree to, to a great degree and feel

like, I've, I say have I remember before?

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Yeah, but small, like really small guys.

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I've even self-published before,

but really like handbooks very,

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more like pamphlets, in the books.

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But not really related to what I do now.

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So I wouldn't, probably

wouldn't pull those things back.

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So I have.

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Published myself I have written books,

but but now this is what I'm working

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on is a much fuller book that really

is my whole framework and my whole

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philosophy principles around what I do

and how that's gonna help Others as well.

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So I'm excited for it, but I will say

this first time when I got somebody

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to take a look at my my framework,

the skeleton bare bones of the book.

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And they, the first comment

to me was this is four books

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.

Angie: Okay.

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Yeah.

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John: but then why not?

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It's okay, that's actually not bad.

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So that makes my life a bit easier now to

get that great feedback from someone who

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knows about these things and say okay,

it can be four books and this can be.

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Part one of those four books

or maybe becomes three books.

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Who knows but but not to really put too

much Into one book because that whole

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thing about talk about with speaking.

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We don't want to overteach.

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We don't want to overdo it whilst we want

to deliver value we want people to be

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able to absorb what they're delivering

and to be able to use and apply it and

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something that ends up being almost like

a Bible of presentation skills so to

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speak might be a bit overwhelming for a

lot of people and maybe even hard to use

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Angie: I was going to say, I

just was going to say that.

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I think that when there's too much

information that it just, what

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happens is the lessons get murky.

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They get lost and I actually

just had a session with somebody

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last night and I encouraged her.

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We're having this conversation

and I said to her, maybe what you

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should do because it was about

she was writing some things down.

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And I said I think that you

need to break those things down.

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I didn't say go write another

book, but it was interesting.

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It was really.

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When that person said to you, I have four

books, like this is four books, right?

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Don't overcomplicate it

because the lessons get lost.

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And, sometimes we have to

go back and revisit, right?

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That's it's okay.

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Because when people, if we have one book

and people want to come back and revisit.

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Maybe it's a workshop.

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Maybe it's if you want there

to be more tangibles, right?

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Maybe then you're creating a whole

different type of curriculum around the

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book, which again, what are we doing here?

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We're expanding our business.

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And it's funny because I actually have

two books going and it's, again, it's

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because to your point, and I didn't

realize it, and this just puts lights on

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light on it, that the first book really.

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Was more, it should be, I should keep

it where, what it was meant to be and

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then take specific topics that I touch

on and turn those into more, right?

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Because there is more to learn.

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There is more to say.

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Yeah, I think it's so much more

commonplace now to have a book

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than I don't know, 20 years ago.

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What do you think about that?

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I

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John: Yeah, it really is and I do think

that probably self publishing is so much

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easier now than it ever was that it almost

doesn't make sense not to and I have I

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have a connection who's a really good

marketing expert and he's turned out books

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like he'll spend three weeks working on

a book and then self publish it and he's

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done okay with that i mean i've read some

of the books and yeah they're littered

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with spelling mistakes and things like

that but There's good content in there

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and there's things that can be really

helpful you know if you're willing to let

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go of that sort of it needs to be perfect

and all the Syntax and spelling needs

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to be spot on If you can let go of that

to some degree like do you maybe want

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to spend a bit of money on an editor?

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Sure, especially if you're looking to

write take the book into the mainstream

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and maybe take it to a publisher at some

point, you may well want to do that.

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But really, could you move ahead

on a budget and maybe just self

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publish something yourself?

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Absolutely.

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And I've done it with smaller books and

to some degree, I will do that this, with

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this book as well, although I probably

will at least spend a couple of hundred

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bucks on getting it, getting someone

to take a look do a quick edit on it.

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Who has

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Angie: think it's important though

to try to identify that for like

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the people listening, right?

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Because there might be people here

listening to us right now saying.

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Self publishing.

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What is that?

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I think that there's not.

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It's not a natural place where people

who are building coaching practices

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or in personal development necessarily

say, Oh, that's a goal as well.

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There's going to be these

verticals within my business.

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And one of them is going

to be my book writing.

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So tell us tell our audience, right?

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What are really the big difference?

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You touched on a little bit, but

why would I or why would I not?

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Yeah.

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Self publish, specifically.

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John: Partly it's looking at the

benefits of each one that we do

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want to get the clear pros and cons.

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When you go to a publishers, if you

have a good concept for a book, and

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it has a very clear market and it's

clearly commercial for them, then they

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will be able to do things like offer

you an advance on the book and And.

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Maybe they will be able to have

better distribution than you might

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be able to manage by yourself.

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That doesn't mean that it's

gonna sell like hotcakes.

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It doesn't mean that it is going

to be a successful book for you and

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the chances of you making any money.

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With a properly published book, low it's

still going to be what we call a lost

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leader That you're not really going to

be able to make much money off it and

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unless you have a huge international

success, but so few people have that and

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that probably speaks to you really need

to be able to Tap into whatever zeitgeist

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is going on whatever's hot Right now, or

people want to get into you need to be

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right there with what you do at the right

time to some degree for that to really

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work and to have a really solid strategy.

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When you go to a publisher You have to

go with a book proposal First of all,

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you could you don't just go and throw

your completed manuscript at them and

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say here's my book you have to give

them a book proposal and we're talking

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we are talking Non fiction particularly

probably personal development of the

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likes books and so with that you have to

be clear on all the information they want

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from you in a book proposal that can be

Almost as much work as writing your book.

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So they want the outline, they

want the clarity of who it's for,

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what the book's going to do for

the audience, all of these things.

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And you can usually get the, you

can usually get all that information

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off publishers websites to be able

to, what they want information

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from you for a book proposal.

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They don't want to read

your completed book.

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They want to read your proposal and

and see if it's any good from there.

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Part of the reason is, They

actually do know a fair bit more

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about publishing styles and what

works well and what doesn't.

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So they may ask you to make changes.

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And that's much harder to do

if you've completed the book.

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They can sometimes, if they like the

concept and they think it's cool, Got

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good commercial value They may well

have someone work with you a bit on the

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structure and design and layout of the

book to make sure it's gonna fit with

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what they already have in their library

and with their audiences in the right

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way, so Yeah, there's things there that

could be beneficial to you but for most

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coaches and speakers Self publishing,

and there's so many different options for

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this as well from just like essentially

having a PDF version of your book that

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you can give to people or self printing.

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You can self print your books

and sell them at your own events.

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We talked about this with speaking, you

can include them in part of, as part of

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your negotiation for speaking events.

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You can use them as a calling card for

clients as a an introductory offer To

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bring people like a funnel to bring people

in deeper into your coaching world That's

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pretty low entry because if someone can't

even you know Someone's not even going

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to pay to have a book delivered to them.

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They're not going to pay

for your coaching either.

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So But yeah, these are some of the

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Angie: it's got ancillary

value to it, for sure.

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But here's the thing.

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I'm gonna sit here and say this to you

because this just like when we talked

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about podcasting you've already self

published, so you're ahead of me.

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You've done it before me.

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But I feel like, I would be speaking

for maybe the entire audience that's

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listening when I ask this question if

we, because I feel like most people

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are going to want to monetize where you

mentioned oh, you can bring it to an

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event and offer it and, promote it that

way and create this like collaboration

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and layers of what you're offering.

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And I think that's great.

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People love the stuff.

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Nobody wants to walk away with

a pen with your website on it.

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That's like a real value.

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But if somebody really wanted to

monetize a book because it's effort,

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it's, not something we're necessarily

going to be throwing gather, what's

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the what, again, I'm sure there's

a million perspectives on this.

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So I'm just asking John, by the way.

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In his, for in his experience or

in his opinion, what would be the

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best route for somebody to take?

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John: i'm certainly by no means an

authority on this but But what I do

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know is when you self publish You are in

control of your marketing when a book gets

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published through Mainstream publishers

it may get marketed the one time but they

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do still expect you to primarily take care

of the marketing strategy for that and You

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It's much like any information product.

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How do you sell any kind

of information product?

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That's what a book is

at the end of the day.

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How do you sell that?

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How do you market it?

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How do you promote it?

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You want to maybe build up your e build

up your email list and perhaps you're

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gonna maybe even utilize buzz around,

start creating some buzz around the

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book to build that up and going on.

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Going on podcast as a guest, we talked

about that recently going on talking

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about the book that's coming out, build

up some interest there, maybe even create

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a waiting list for your book so that

you can perhaps at least get onto an

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Amazon bestsellers list pretty quick.

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There are some pretty good

resources out there to help you

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know how to best market your book.

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But the good thing with that is

you can turn up the marketing,

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turn on the marketing taps for

your book anytime you want.

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And so I think that if you actually want

to make money from your book, great.

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You might just want it as a

tool, something you can sell at

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events and don't really care if

it's in book charts or whatever.

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That's fine.

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But if you do at least want to get it

onto an Amazon bestseller list, there

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are plenty of people who offer some great

strategies for helping you to do that.

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And it's really not, It's

difficult getting it onto

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the wall street journal, but

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Angie: new york times bestseller

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John: york times bestsellers list?

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That's a very different beast indeed

and requires a much more significant

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strategy But again, there are people

you know, if that's your goal There

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are people out there who could be

able to help you do that So it might

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depend on what level you're at.

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I certainly think the self publishing

route for most people Is the easier

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path to go down and there are So many

different levels though, like people

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will essentially some degree give you

the whole strategy for doing this There

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are some people who will do it along with

you And there are some people who'll even

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take care of it all for you And maybe

even ghostwrite your whole book for you.

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Angie: I

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John: All of that's out

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Angie: about ghostwriting because I yeah,

because I feel like this I feel like

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my perception of book writing, right?

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I wrote a small book in college.

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It was part of a class.

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I was taking little

novelette and it was great.

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A plus, this was amazing.

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I had to share with my colleagues

because there was some mystery in there.

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Who knew?

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I just love to articulate

and get things down.

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But it's so funny because my perception

was in order to have a book published,

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you had to be an author, right?

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That was your profession.

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And that's just not true anymore.

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It has, that whole space has evolved,

obviously since, I guess I feel like a

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little bit of a mini dinosaur, right?

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Because I'm talking about a time when.

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That was the truth.

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You had to be an author for the most

part in order to get something published.

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And that's just not the case anymore.

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So it is another viable

opportunity to get things done.

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If I had, listen, if I had three

weeks, you were mentioning something

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about a friend of yours that,

knocked it out in three, three weeks.

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If somebody locked me in a cabin, like

Stephen King does go lock me up somewhere.

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I could knock out the two books

that I have probably like pretty

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quickly, because I'd be having, I

would have the time and attention.

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And now because I am focusing on

the writing, it's, I need a couple

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of hours of, this is why it hasn't

been, why is it going on for so long?

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Why is it taking me so long?

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Because I don't feel like I've had.

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The time because I have to get into

this mental zone to create what

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it is or to reflect on what it is.

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I'm trying to say create a flow.

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It's not a 15 minute thing

unless it's just a quick idea.

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Oh, I want to throw this in there.

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It can be time consuming, but I think

if you outline things and you really

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decide what it is you want to talk about.

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It will probably happen a little

bit more quickly, but I just feel

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like and tell me do you agree?

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I think that the mindset is that it used

to be like you had to be an author But you

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don't and ghostwriting somebody just like

I don't know maybe the universe is talking

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: 00:17:54

to me somebody on LinkedIn was like hey

I'm a ghostwriter and I'm like, oh, maybe

306

: 00:17:59

do you wanna talk about that a little bit?

307

: 00:18:02

What'd you say?

308

: 00:18:03

John: I said I don't believe in ghosts.

309

: 00:18:04

Angie: Oh, you will, you come

to my house and you will . Okay.

310

: 00:18:08

That's all I'm gonna say.

311

: 00:18:11

John: But yeah I know that there are

people like with podcasts who have

312

: 00:18:15

had somebody, handed the transcripts

of the podcast over to somebody to

313

: 00:18:20

turn, have them turned into a book

formatted and turned into a book.

314

: 00:18:23

And people have done that and sometimes

it's done really well with that.

315

: 00:18:27

So I know that is also an option,

when I have nearly 200 episodes of

316

: 00:18:31

my other show, that is an option.

317

: 00:18:33

There's probably plenty of stuff in

there that would make valuable book

318

: 00:18:36

content and would probably do very well.

319

: 00:18:38

So that's another option

for the future as well.

320

: 00:18:41

But the whole point of having the, in the

first place is that expert positioning.

321

: 00:18:47

And that, I think that is, it's

not just to make money from it.

322

: 00:18:50

Hopefully you can make some

money from your book as well.

323

: 00:18:52

That's certainly a good thing to do, but

for coaches more than anything, it does

324

: 00:18:57

give you a level of expert positioning.

325

: 00:19:00

You can say podcast does

to some degree, but.

326

: 00:19:03

Somehow it doesn't have the same

Gravitas as having a book published

327

: 00:19:08

even if you've self published it

328

: 00:19:09

Angie: I, I'm not sure that

everybody even thinks that a book is

329

: 00:19:13

something that might be necessary.

330

: 00:19:15

And if it was, why?

331

: 00:19:17

So it's not just always about monetizing.

332

: 00:19:20

It is about that expert positioning.

333

: 00:19:22

It's about completing the package, so

to speak, and not necessarily a package

334

: 00:19:27

that you're going to sell, but just

another piece of what you're doing

335

: 00:19:33

and your mission and your passion.

336

: 00:19:35

I love it.

337

: 00:19:36

I think it's a great idea to add it on.

338

: 00:19:42

John: Here's what I'll say

as well to add on to this.

339

: 00:19:45

I don't think it's

something for new coaches.

340

: 00:19:48

Angie: I agree.

341

: 00:19:50

John: Unless you really have a specific

Point of view framework concept there's

342

: 00:19:56

going to be really valuable to people

and is your intellectual property if

343

: 00:20:00

you already have that Great, but I would

probably still look to take some time

344

: 00:20:04

to validate it in coaching and to have

the case studies and the history and the

345

: 00:20:08

knowledge of working with it this is one

of the things that did come up for me.

346

: 00:20:12

And I had ended up having an

interview on someone with my show.

347

: 00:20:14

I'd mostly finished writing a book and

then had a professional ghostwriter

348

: 00:20:21

come and be a guest on my show.

349

: 00:20:23

She's written some great books.

350

: 00:20:24

I think I will share her name is

Ginny Carter and she's written.

351

: 00:20:27

But called like your business your book.

352

: 00:20:29

I think she had more recent ones.

353

: 00:20:31

I have to write a personal how

to write self help book Great.

354

: 00:20:34

She's really good really knowledgeable

on this stuff Super nice person as well,

355

: 00:20:37

and i'll put a link to that episode

if you want to listen to it Into the

356

: 00:20:40

show notes as well, but One of the

things she said that really hit home

357

: 00:20:44

for me was like you need to be able to

demonstrate that this has been In action.

358

: 00:20:47

Otherwise, it's just kind of conceptual

knowledge which I think is really

359

: 00:20:51

important and it's one of the reasons why

I held off On that particular book and

360

: 00:20:55

thought I don't have enough validation

In my work experience to be able to feel

361

: 00:21:01

confident going ahead and publishing

could you still go ahead and publish?

362

: 00:21:04

Yes, but Are you gonna feel like

you're on weaker ground if you do that?

363

: 00:21:08

Probably I would have And so

it felt like it would have been

364

: 00:21:12

a little you know whilst i'm

almost ready to push the button.

365

: 00:21:15

I realized the book was probably

only really half done and there was

366

: 00:21:19

a lot that needed to still Happen

Before it's ready to be published.

367

: 00:21:23

So this is one of the reasons why it's

like it is a slightly higher level thing

368

: 00:21:26

And yes, there is a certain level of

work and commitment involved in this

369

: 00:21:30

and you do need to figure out You know

the time isn't just going to appear to

370

: 00:21:34

write your book You do need to, you do

need to create the time, whether you

371

: 00:21:38

give yourself three weeks locked in a

cabin or whether you give yourself an

372

: 00:21:41

hour every morning or whether you join

one of these groups that are around

373

: 00:21:45

where people get together and spend an

hour on Zoom together just writing on

374

: 00:21:50

their books and have that check in time.

375

: 00:21:53

Of these things can help you,

but you ultimately done is . I

376

: 00:21:59

say, done is better than perfect.

377

: 00:22:01

Get your book done.

378

: 00:22:02

If you have the idea and you really want

to do it, and you wanna have a book as

379

: 00:22:05

to represent you and your expertise and

to give you that positioning, do it.

380

: 00:22:11

Get it done.

381

: 00:22:12

Angie: Yeah, I think to your point about

you know Also, I think there's that if

382

: 00:22:16

you're a newer coach, it is a just another

distraction You need to establish you and

383

: 00:22:21

you might have some really great ideas

on what a great book could be or a topic

384

: 00:22:27

that you'd want to talk about but I agree.

385

: 00:22:29

I think that you probably need to get

yourself into that space a little bit

386

: 00:22:34

to back up things a little bit more

depending on what the topic actually is.

387

: 00:22:38

But also for me, when I think about

productivity, is it a distraction?

388

: 00:22:44

If you're a newer coach, there's a ton

of things that you're working on and

389

: 00:22:48

you don't even know yet what it is.

390

: 00:22:49

You don't know what you don't know.

391

: 00:22:51

And you and I we've revamped recently,

we've been coaches for a long time.

392

: 00:22:55

And even with all the experience,

it's months, like in my mind, I'm

393

: 00:23:00

like, Oh, I can just knock this out.

394

: 00:23:02

It's months to structure or restructure.

395

: 00:23:06

And right now, throwing the book into the

mix is just not, it's not even on my list.

396

: 00:23:11

It's just not.

397

: 00:23:12

John: It's a point of overwhelm, right?

398

: 00:23:14

Angie: Yeah.

399

: 00:23:14

John: If you let it be that yeah I

wouldn't encourage anyone to ever put

400

: 00:23:18

themselves in that position of overwhelm.

401

: 00:23:20

It's always the case that you add it's

always add one more thing add one more

402

: 00:23:24

thing You do not need to be doing all the

things at once you do need to figure out

403

: 00:23:28

a logical order and if your business isn't

happening Maybe writing a book right now.

404

: 00:23:33

It isn't your biggest priority

maybe getting clients happening.

405

: 00:23:38

Another way is a better priority to have

But maybe if you are looking to head

406

: 00:23:43

on the road as a speaker It might be

a good idea to at least be working on

407

: 00:23:46

your book But Now maybe there's a middle

ground as well perhaps start writing a

408

: 00:23:51

blog maybe even start, just recording

some thoughts down do some off the cuff

409

: 00:23:56

relaxed youtube videos where you're just

talking about these things You'll start

410

: 00:24:00

to figure out what you want to say and

at least start finding your own voice.

411

: 00:24:03

I like the idea of Starting

a blog perhaps more.

412

: 00:24:06

Yes.

413

: 00:24:07

People do still read blogs and Newsletters

and people do still like them as well.

414

: 00:24:11

There's a huge market for them bigger than

big still bigger than the podcast market

415

: 00:24:16

and It will help you learn how to write As

well, if you don't already have that skill

416

: 00:24:22

and you'll get better at talking about

it, you can, you'll get more comfortable

417

: 00:24:26

explaining things, putting things down

on paper and getting out of your head.

418

: 00:24:30

Yeah, it can help you to start

to create your framework and your

419

: 00:24:33

points and principles and whatever

else you want to add in there.

420

: 00:24:36

Angie: I agree.

421

: 00:24:37

And I think to your point earlier, it

doesn't have to be like everything right

422

: 00:24:42

at the moment, but I also, I'm going

to counter something that you said.

423

: 00:24:46

I'm going to say that sometimes,

cause I love I still blog.

424

: 00:24:50

when I was blogging initially,

it was really more random and it

425

: 00:24:54

was just me getting to know me.

426

: 00:24:56

I needed to know and understand

my voice because coaching was

427

: 00:25:00

one thing, speaking is another.

428

: 00:25:02

And how I communicate with my

audience, how do I do that?

429

: 00:25:06

So I started the blogging piece

because it was just little things

430

: 00:25:10

that I had learned along the way.

431

: 00:25:12

And I felt let me talk about it.

432

: 00:25:13

Let's see how this goes.

433

: 00:25:15

And it might go really well.

434

: 00:25:17

I got really good response from my

blog, to be honest with you, it wasn't

435

: 00:25:22

just because I was so important.

436

: 00:25:23

It just started small and then

started growing, to snowball, which

437

: 00:25:26

is what we want to have happen anyway.

438

: 00:25:30

Your book is another way to

communicate with your audience.

439

: 00:25:34

It just is.

440

: 00:25:35

And I think it's so funny because you

and I both coached people who were

441

: 00:25:39

like, I want to go, I want to be a

speaker and I want to be a this and a

442

: 00:25:43

coach and I'm going to write a book.

443

: 00:25:44

And I what would you do yesterday?

444

: 00:25:47

Oh I was like, I was,

the CEO at such and such.

445

: 00:25:50

And I'm like, okay, wait,

let's take a step back.

446

: 00:25:52

You're laughing because you know how

many of those people we encountered,

447

: 00:25:55

but you have to really remember

that everything that you do.

448

: 00:26:01

To interact with the public is an

interaction and how you communicate,

449

: 00:26:06

I think it's really important

into to branding yourself and how

450

: 00:26:11

you're received by the audience.

451

: 00:26:13

John: Yeah, I think we do have to

bring up the AI thing as well because

452

: 00:26:21

it is possible to use AI tools to.

453

: 00:26:25

Potentially to write your book for you.

454

: 00:26:27

I don't recommend that.

455

: 00:26:28

I don't think AI is there yet And I don't

think yeah and you would still want it

456

: 00:26:33

to be at least trained on your voice

and your style before you did that there

457

: 00:26:37

would still be some work to do there But

you could probably at least get some help

458

: 00:26:41

from AI tools on creating your outline

Maybe even creating a book proposal

459

: 00:26:45

if that's if you want to go through

A traditional publishing route there.

460

: 00:26:50

There are a lot of things where it can

help Shortcut, or you can make sure

461

: 00:26:54

that you're covering a topic fully.

462

: 00:26:57

What are the things that you should

make sure that you're covering when

463

: 00:26:59

you're talking about this, to make

sure that you have exhausted the topic

464

: 00:27:04

and not left anything important out.

465

: 00:27:06

I think all that kind of stuff,

it can really help you there.

466

: 00:27:09

And so I would encourage you to use

AI to some degree, whether it's chat

467

: 00:27:14

GPT or Gemini, whatever it is that

they're great tools, but I wouldn't

468

: 00:27:19

Ask them to do the whole thing for you.

469

: 00:27:21

It's not there yet.

470

: 00:27:24

Even if you had even if you have the

podcast transcripts and hand, they

471

: 00:27:28

pump all those into chat, GPT or

whatever, and say, put them into a

472

: 00:27:32

book format, I still wouldn't trust it.

473

: 00:27:35

I still wouldn't trust it

to do that at the moment.

474

: 00:27:37

So so yeah use it as a tool to help

you develop this I would say hang

475

: 00:27:42

on other people may have different

opinions to be honest But I think it's

476

: 00:27:45

a great thing to help you It should be

your author helper if you're going to

477

: 00:27:49

do that rather than your ghost writer

478

: 00:27:53

Angie: Yeah, no, I think when you

mentioned that, when you were like,

479

: 00:27:56

wait a minute, we don't want chat

GPT to be writing everything I had

480

: 00:28:00

this flashback and I did interact

with somebody a short while ago.

481

: 00:28:05

Who was like writing everything or

creating everything through chat GPT.

482

: 00:28:12

And I was like, I've been working with

you and this doesn't, this is and I

483

: 00:28:15

asked, I'm like, are you using chat

GPT or something like AI on this?

484

: 00:28:20

And they were like

yeah, isn't it fabulous?

485

: 00:28:21

And I'm like, no, because I know you

and I, it doesn't even sound like

486

: 00:28:27

you, and so I had to pull the plug on

that a little bit with them and say,

487

: 00:28:31

wait a minute, it's a great tool.

488

: 00:28:34

Still need to be the human in the room.

489

: 00:28:36

John: I would say so if you just look if

you really just want to throw something

490

: 00:28:39

out there and you're not too concerned

You just want something there Maybe

491

: 00:28:43

give that a go and see what happens.

492

: 00:28:45

But yeah, I it wouldn't be the path that I

would choose to take I think it's you know

493

: 00:28:49

that's too much just trying to shortcut

the system and and take any level of work

494

: 00:28:54

Angie: I agree.

495

: 00:28:55

John: I can you I could have AI write

my blog for me But it's not going

496

: 00:28:58

to be in my voice unless I at least

start to train it in how I write

497

: 00:29:02

and how I speak and communicate so

498

: 00:29:05

Angie: Plus you lose your ability.

499

: 00:29:07

I have to say something, for me,

I, in my coaching practice and my

500

: 00:29:10

speaking practice, I don't love,

I do not love administrative work.

501

: 00:29:14

Let me just reiterate that

for the 9, 000th time episode.

502

: 00:29:18

What are we on?

503

: 00:29:18

37 today.

504

: 00:29:20

But

505

: 00:29:21

John: Something like that.

506

: 00:29:22

Angie: the, what I love about

being in business for myself.

507

: 00:29:26

Is my ability to be creative to bring

myself into this industry or these

508

: 00:29:34

industries My ideas even if it was like,

it's so funny You know somebody will hand

509

: 00:29:39

me a recipe and we all know I love to cook

love to cook I always have to make it my

510

: 00:29:43

own I have to you know I tweak I look at

the whole thing and say that sounds good.

511

: 00:29:47

I bet you this would be a great

addition To that let me try it this

512

: 00:29:52

way And it's not because I have to

be right or on my way is better.

513

: 00:29:55

It's my creative juices.

514

: 00:29:58

So when you're, and I'm not saying

that I don't use it because I just

515

: 00:30:01

started using AI for a couple of

things and it has worked for me.

516

: 00:30:05

I think it's great in the capacity

in which I'm working, I'm using it,

517

: 00:30:09

but I never want to lose my voice

as the speaker, as a coach, as a

518

: 00:30:13

personal development expert, because

that's what makes me, that's where

519

: 00:30:18

the, That's where the connection to

the people is really going to happen.

520

: 00:30:22

And I'm guaranteeing there are naysayers

out there that are going AI can do that.

521

: 00:30:26

It can learn you.

522

: 00:30:27

It can learn anything.

523

: 00:30:28

It's smarter than us.

524

: 00:30:29

Yeah, it's supposed to be, but it's

still never going to be Angie ever.

525

: 00:30:33

So you don't want to lose that

because as you are expanding and

526

: 00:30:38

growing, it's good to be able to keep

yourself present within your business.

527

: 00:30:44

Just saying.

528

: 00:30:45

John: That's part of this

writing process as well.

529

: 00:30:46

Like one of the reasons why I

never looked at ghost writers

530

: 00:30:49

before was because I want it.

531

: 00:30:53

I want my books, my

content to be my words.

532

: 00:30:57

I want it to come from me through me and

rather than just be perhaps editing or

533

: 00:31:03

altering something that has been created

by chat GPT, that may be as a personal

534

: 00:31:06

preference that perhaps not everybody

shares, but that's where I stand with it.

535

: 00:31:11

And I do think, I was just thinking

maybe 10 years into the future, it's

536

: 00:31:15

we're just, Towards the end of 2024

right now, maybe 10 years in the future.

537

: 00:31:19

Someone's listening to this old

episode of of the coaching clinic.

538

: 00:31:23

I'm thinking, but chat

GPT does everything now.

539

: 00:31:26

It knows my brain knows where I

know who knows where things will

540

: 00:31:30

be with AI by that time, given

how fast things tend to progress.

541

: 00:31:34

But right, right

542

: 00:31:36

Angie: We should fully expect

that AI is going to change the

543

: 00:31:40

landscape of all the things, right?

544

: 00:31:43

And, I think that we've

had look at the Jetsons.

545

: 00:31:46

Remember that cartoon from

I don't know, the 70s?

546

: 00:31:48

Who knew that we would be having AI?

547

: 00:31:50

There's George Jetson talking to his

boss, whatever the guy's name was on a TV.

548

: 00:31:55

And that's just seemed so futuristic.

549

: 00:31:58

And, I think the only thing

we haven't done yet, there was

550

: 00:32:01

Rosie the maid, she was a robot.

551

: 00:32:04

Now we have a robot that

cleans our floors for us.

552

: 00:32:06

Like we don't know what we don't

know yet, but for today, for sure,

553

: 00:32:11

it's still nice to be a human and

be creative and have our message.

554

: 00:32:17

Yeah.

555

: 00:32:17

Put out there, right?

556

: 00:32:18

Speaking our language in our way.

557

: 00:32:22

I don't even know if I'd

want to meet the robotic me.

558

: 00:32:24

I have to be

559

: 00:32:26

saying.

560

: 00:32:27

John: But here's a take I have on this.

561

: 00:32:29

If you create a book with using

artificial means and you haven't

562

: 00:32:35

written it You're always going to

know I think there's always going to

563

: 00:32:38

be that thing of you're not going to

feel completely in integrity with it

564

: 00:32:42

Because you didn't actually create it.

565

: 00:32:44

It didn't come from you and so unless

it has been pulled from If you've

566

: 00:32:49

pumped in a load of previous blogs

or podcast transcripts or whatever

567

: 00:32:53

else, then maybe there's an argument

that it has then come from you.

568

: 00:32:57

But you, if you haven't actually

been part of the creative process,

569

: 00:33:01

and you're always going to feel like

it wasn't really you that did this.

570

: 00:33:03

It's just something there that

speaks to what you speak to.

571

: 00:33:08

I do think there's a personal

integrity thing there.

572

: 00:33:10

And maybe even that sort of deeper

connection and empathy that You

573

: 00:33:13

know, AI can perhaps emulate elements

of that, but it's never going

574

: 00:33:17

to do it the way you will do it.

575

: 00:33:19

It's never, we're never going to

be able to connect human to human,

576

: 00:33:22

the way artificial intelligence is

never going to be able to do that.

577

: 00:33:25

However good it gets, we're always going

to know it's artificial intelligence.

578

: 00:33:29

Angie: Absolutely.

579

: 00:33:30

Absolutely.

580

: 00:33:31

And I do, I can see so many

people thinking I can do this.

581

: 00:33:34

I can make this happen.

582

: 00:33:35

That'll make this, that'll

shorten the journey for me.

583

: 00:33:38

I would be careful about it.

584

: 00:33:40

Anytime I use AI on anything now, of

course I go back and I rewatch or relisten

585

: 00:33:45

and then I go, Nope, that didn't work.

586

: 00:33:47

Let me change this.

587

: 00:33:48

John: Yeah I spoke to, I spoke

recently to someone who does have

588

: 00:33:52

some expertise in AI, who was

talking about AI hallucinations and

589

: 00:33:58

they are very real things through a

networking program that I'm in and.

590

: 00:34:03

One of the things she was saying with

that is that it's a very real thing

591

: 00:34:06

that it will, if it doesn't know

something, it will create something

592

: 00:34:10

that sounds good or that sounds

realistic that may not actually be true.

593

: 00:34:14

And this has happened a number of times

to a point where is given historical

594

: 00:34:20

historical events that never happened.

595

: 00:34:22

Things like that.

596

: 00:34:23

Or police arrests that never

happened or never existed.

597

: 00:34:26

Just data that he has actually created as

a hallucination that isn't actually real.

598

: 00:34:31

You do have to be really careful.

599

: 00:34:33

The very best, you have to, Pool stuff

but all this stuff of, I think there

600

: 00:34:38

is a degree to which we value something

more the Ikea effect if you've ever heard

601

: 00:34:42

of that, we value something a lot more

when we played a part in creating it.

602

: 00:34:48

Angie: Oh,

603

: 00:34:49

John: And for a book or something that

we've created that's like a it's like

604

: 00:34:52

it Could be a baby to some degree.

605

: 00:34:53

It's something you can create and put

out into the world and it's going to

606

: 00:34:57

help people you're going to value it a

lot more yourself if you have actually

607

: 00:35:01

Been the creator the person who birthed

the book I use that very intentionally

608

: 00:35:06

because I know there are people out

there who call themselves book midwives

609

: 00:35:08

as sort of book coaches To get your

book birthed and out into the world.

610

: 00:35:12

You Is that even as an audience there's

a level to which I think we appreciate

611

: 00:35:19

the effort that someone else has

put into Creating something as well.

612

: 00:35:24

We value that too.

613

: 00:35:25

So if we I think if we suspect

that someone has just Pulled

614

: 00:35:30

this together from chat gpt.

615

: 00:35:32

We're gonna we're probably going to make

some judgments on that as well Whereas

616

: 00:35:36

if we actually can be very clear that

someone clearly has done some research

617

: 00:35:39

and put a lot of effort and energy

Into this they put in case studies.

618

: 00:35:42

They've done years of work in this area

619

: 00:35:43

That has a lot more effect

and impact on people

620

: 00:35:47

Angie: Listen, I'm going to

bring in, you're so right.

621

: 00:35:49

And I was sitting here listening and

I'm thinking back to my, my love of

622

: 00:35:53

cooking and wanting to change a recipe.

623

: 00:35:56

And I think it like relates specifically

like that for me, if I serve a big

624

: 00:36:01

dinner that I have I've ordered in.

625

: 00:36:04

I don't care.

626

: 00:36:05

Like I, of course I'm happy everybody's

eating and they're fed, but there's

627

: 00:36:09

no pride in ownership, right?

628

: 00:36:11

It's not my food.

629

: 00:36:12

I didn't create it.

630

: 00:36:13

I didn't cook it.

631

: 00:36:14

I didn't plan it.

632

: 00:36:15

However, when I, cause I've had events

where I have a food truck and, it's

633

: 00:36:21

like, Oh my God, the food is so good.

634

: 00:36:22

And I'm like, Oh, that's great.

635

: 00:36:23

I'm happy that they enjoy the food.

636

: 00:36:25

However, if I'm the one that's

creating the meal and, think of

637

: 00:36:30

each part of the meal itself, right?

638

: 00:36:32

As like a chapter, right?

639

: 00:36:33

I created each of those.

640

: 00:36:35

So when I set it out there,

there is a different level

641

: 00:36:39

of commitment to is it good?

642

: 00:36:41

What could be changed?

643

: 00:36:42

Is this, how's it being received?

644

: 00:36:44

And it's really the same for me.

645

: 00:36:45

I don't know why it always goes

back to recipes and cooking for me.

646

: 00:36:48

But there's a different,

it's just different.

647

: 00:36:51

If I put somebody else's meatballs

in front of you and you don't

648

: 00:36:54

like them, I don't really care.

649

: 00:36:56

But if I put my meatballs in

front of you, I'm like wait

650

: 00:36:58

John: who do your family appreciate

more than they appreciate you more

651

: 00:37:02

when you put all that care and effort

into feeling them or when you've

652

: 00:37:04

just called up the delivery truck?

653

: 00:37:07

Angie: absolutely.

654

: 00:37:07

Food is my love language.

655

: 00:37:08

They know that, I make the

favorites, I do the things.

656

: 00:37:11

And if I go and I order

it, it is not the same.

657

: 00:37:14

Not just in the flavor and the taste, it's

how I, what the emphasis is how I feel.

658

: 00:37:19

There's a pride.

659

: 00:37:20

That when I put a spread out, John

says he's going to come and visit,

660

: 00:37:23

so I can't wait to do that for him.

661

: 00:37:25

But when I lay out that spread, a.

662

: 00:37:27

k.

663

: 00:37:27

a.

664

: 00:37:28

the book there's just this pride.

665

: 00:37:30

And I wouldn't say there's nerves,

but I'm always like, hey, I'm curious.

666

: 00:37:33

So what do you think?

667

: 00:37:34

I love the feedback.

668

: 00:37:36

Oh, it was salty.

669

: 00:37:37

It was this or it was perfect.

670

: 00:37:38

Don't change anything.

671

: 00:37:39

So it's that's how I relate to it.

672

: 00:37:41

Like you, it, there is definitely

more pride in ownership instead

673

: 00:37:45

of it just being like something

that you churn out some way.

674

: 00:37:48

I just don't, I don't go for it yet.

675

: 00:37:50

And I'm probably not going to even

be alive when all of this stuff

676

: 00:37:54

can be done 100 percent for us.

677

: 00:37:57

I don't think I'll be on the planet.

678

: 00:37:58

I'm not overly concerned about it.

679

: 00:38:00

But, because it's up and coming,

I do see so many people relying on

680

: 00:38:06

chat GPT to do the thinking for them.

681

: 00:38:09

And that's just

682

: 00:38:10

John: maybe we'll be, maybe we'll

be uploaded into the cloud and

683

: 00:38:13

we'll still be, a hundred years

from now doing our podcast.

684

: 00:38:18

Angie: ah, oh my gosh, I don't

even know what we would sound like.

685

: 00:38:22

I think we'd be like, in some type

of educational system, like back

686

: 00:38:27

in the day, this is how coaches

and speakers made their living.

687

: 00:38:33

John: It would be more

of a history podcast, at

688

: 00:38:35

Angie: certainly would be.

689

: 00:38:39

John: but other than other paths

being new or maybe not being

690

: 00:38:41

experienced enough in your area yet.

691

: 00:38:43

I can't really think of any other reasons

why you might not want to write a book

692

: 00:38:46

other than perhaps just being focused on

what actually really matters right now.

693

: 00:38:51

I'll say, definitely good advice not

to just add one more thing to probably

694

: 00:38:54

what's already a very busy to do list when

you are focused on growing a business.

695

: 00:38:59

But if you're at a point where you

think, I think I'm ready for this, it's

696

: 00:39:02

going to help you probably get if you

haven't already got your frameworks

697

: 00:39:05

and things like that figured out,

it's probably going to help you with

698

: 00:39:07

that and give you some great content.

699

: 00:39:09

If you are someone who's working

for a coaching company, looking

700

: 00:39:12

to perhaps strike out solo.

701

: 00:39:14

This could be a great way to help you

clarify that kind of information and

702

: 00:39:19

put things together so you know what

you're going to be offering and the

703

: 00:39:22

transformation, the clear transformation

you're going to be able to offer to your

704

: 00:39:26

audience, it could help you pull all

that together, at least, even if you just

705

: 00:39:30

outline a book and don't even get as far

as writing it, I think that would give

706

: 00:39:34

you a big advantage in moving forward.

707

: 00:39:37

But for those of you.

708

: 00:39:39

For those of you who are thinking

about that, yeah, it's time to do this.

709

: 00:39:41

Time to get ready for it.

710

: 00:39:43

Let us know commit to writing a book and

let us know you're committing to and tell

711

: 00:39:47

us what your book's going to be about.

712

: 00:39:48

We'd love to, we'd love to hear from you.

713

: 00:39:50

And probably the, one of the best

you can contact us on LinkedIn.

714

: 00:39:54

You can find both of our LinkedIn

profiles in the show notes.

715

: 00:39:57

But you can also you can

also leave us a voicemail.

716

: 00:39:59

You can go to www.

717

: 00:40:00

speakpipe.

718

: 00:40:03

com forward slash the coaching clinic

podcast and leave us a voicemail and we

719

: 00:40:08

will most likely feature you on the show.

720

: 00:40:12

But I think we've I think

we've pretty much covered the

721

: 00:40:14

Angie: Yeah.

722

: 00:40:14

I think so.

723

: 00:40:15

Good information.

724

: 00:40:16

And obviously we never, we're not

looking to make this like into

725

: 00:40:20

a whole like teaching moment.

726

: 00:40:22

If you have those

questions, definitely do.

727

: 00:40:24

I've had several of you

reach out to me privately.

728

: 00:40:27

So I love that.

729

: 00:40:28

Keep that coming.

730

: 00:40:29

Or just get in touch with us the

way that John just shared with you.

731

: 00:40:33

I look forward to that.

732

: 00:40:34

I love the feedback.

733

: 00:40:35

John: Yeah, we love hearing from you.

734

: 00:40:37

So have an amazing rest of your week

Everybody will be back next week

735

: 00:40:40

with more great content for you.

736

: 00:40:42

Hope your coaching businesses are growing

and thriving We will see you next time

737

: 00:40:46

Angie: Bye for now.